It’s a real issue. My property taxes are a 1/3 of my monthly mortgage bill. And the town and state services seem to be getting worse, not better and the school always seems to need more money, not less. It’s infuriating since I know there’s money mismanagement that I am paying for. There’s now a big push by about 5 people in town to apply for a grant to do a study on how to add better bike lanes to our downtown. Which means once the “free” study is done, they’ll want it implemented for god knows how much money which will also require more money and personnel to clear snow from in the winter when we have pot holes in the road. Make it make sense. This issue just might be the one that breaks the camels back though for our town to stop saying yes to everything. I hope.
Hi Kate The gubmint (as we say in Texas) is all about money mismanagement, it’s why the new variety of socialism is so unrealistic. Couldn’t a worker just paint some lines between the right lane and sidewalk for bike lanes? Nope, We need a bunch of dopes to do a study. Absurd.
We've been fighting off something like that in my town, too. But, here it is a proposal to build a Senior Center. Yes, there was grant funding for the study. But who then has to build and maintain the Center for the next X years? And of course the Senior Center will require some staff to coordinate activities and apply for more grants.
Easy one. Just vote them out. When we were looking to purchase a home closer to NYC we looked in Greenwich CT and several towns in Westchester County. We saw a beautiful house for $1.6 million but property taxes were over $46,000 a year. Insane. We bought in CT. Price a bit higher but but property taxes $12 K. What is wrong with New Yorkers. Why do they put up with this insanity. Greenwich schools are at least as good and probably better than Westchester schools. So where is all the money going? Vote them out. Or do liberal Democrats enjoy subsidizing waste, fraud and abuse. Which they clearly are doing?
We live in a world where increasingly people go with the flow when it comes to the size of govt. Increasingly most people want the govt to solve their problems. The larger the govt the more waste, fraud and abuse.
But how do we shrink the size and scope of govt? Do we as a people have the will to do that anymore? And who exactly is WE?
Yesterday i read an essay written by a friend that detailed how the country had changed from what de tocqueville described ( community and other local organizations and groups taking care of their families and neighbors and where being on what we now call welfare was viewed as impinging on one's dignity as a citizen) to what occurred in the 20th century with the great society and the creation of our modern welfare state obliterating the country de tocquiville wrote about. As the writer noted , today WE ( not all) seem to want the govt to simply solve all problems. The result is not just the rampant fraud bruce mentions but so much more at an individual level ( eg getting on disability by scamming the system; that is not an indictment of the notion of disability but the reality of rampant fraud, often facilitated by lawyers and doctors: the disappearance of virtue indeed)
Property taxes aren't the problem; rather it is our dependence on big govt and the fact that as the country grew and became wealthier the old virtues receded. JFK recognized this when he gave his ASK NOT inauguration address. We did not listen then and we are not listening now. We simply want the govt to make things more affordable. But yet no one explains how that is to be done ( other than tax the billionaires ) and what the downside consequences might be of whatever our moronic leaders choose to do next
In the meantime, as bruce notes people need to give serious thought as to where they choose to live ( state or town) recognizing that that choice will impact affordability matters in many different ways.
Exactly. When I hear moaning and groaning about affordability from someone who graduated college and moved to THE CITY for the NY EXPERIENCE, I wonder if little Susie or Mary or Johnny ever thought about the cost of living or the fact that their impact on housing demand might 1) result in overall higher rents and 2) the impact of their NY experience on native NYers who are actual working people. I would love to see data and stats on how many who lived in Manhattan had to move elsewhere due to the increased demand ( and limited supply)
"When contacted for comment, the Real Estate Board of New York (REBNY) President James Whelan told Fox News Digital, "We opposed this tax in part because we warned that determining who is and is not subject to it would be extraordinarily complicated. The fact that so many owners appear to be receiving inaccurate notices raises serious questions about the City's readiness to administer the program. Even we did not expect implementation to be this flawed."
Poor Scott. Socialism is coming for you too. Fellating the mayor apparently didn’t merit a red rose or a Hallmark card. Are you still going to cast your People Magazine’s ‘World’s Sexiest Man’ vote for him this year? Probably.
Sure where I drink lol 😝 but Houston is the NYC of Texas and pompous oil heirs and heiresses like to social climb with $24 martinis. And The new Austin, well it ain’t Shiner Bock and Jim Beam anymore. Sad 😢
I understand. That’s what happens when money comes to town from far away. I bet the bars are still cheep in Odesa. I went there for business once, due diligence on a business. It was when oil was in bust phase. All the shops were closed in town and people just got up and left everything in the stores. A true ghost town.
Good Morning Bruce. Wish I was in France where wine is cheaper than Diet Coke. My old college suitemate freshman year lives in Greenwich, CT and does money management: Curt Gadow. Great guy. Safe travels. PS I like strong wine such as Cote du Rhone
One of my Austin rhythm guitarists is a huge Deadhead (and punk go figure) who showed me some amazing footage of John Meyer channeling Jerry. There is only one Jerry (I say this as a non Deadhead mostly due to the tie dyed druggie followers) but he was a great guitar player. Funny story: my friend got in my car once on the way to practice and saw my cassette of Bill Monroe and said “The Dead like this guy”. Guess he never heard real bluegrass (maybe Old and In the Way). We should have a discussion day on the Dead: good, bad and ugly. lol 😝
We don’t really pay high property taxes here in Florida. The Save Our Homes cap and the homestead exemption with portability up to $500k prevents big tax hikes. That said, our schools are crumbling and we get beat up by insurance premiums.
but they're close. Our homeowner's policy has basically doubled in the last three years - with no claims until this year (hail storm took out the roof).
Ah, but property insurance comes pretty close to being Actual Insurance. (As opposed to the other end of the spectrum, health whateveritis, which long ago ceased to be insurance.) There are many reasons why premiums go up, but a simple way to find out whether the increases are justified: Regularly shop out the policy. (A good agent/broker should be doing that for you routinely.)
Hoping the purposed property tax elimination/reduction bill will pass here in Florida. If passed by voters, it will increase the homestead exemption from 50k to $150,000 and then increase to $250,000 the following year.
If the bill passes, it's possible that a homeowner could pay no property tax (school tax remains as is). The bill doesn't completely eliminate property tax, but it would dramatically benefit homeowners across the board. I'd love to have a tax exemption of 250k.
394,000 is the median home price in Florida according to AI. 150k homestead credit is great for someone who owns an almost 400k property. If passed, it goes up to $250k.
May not be the case in Jen’s neck of the woods, but Florida property values have taken a dip in many areas, including mine. A neighbor listed her house for 400k (too high in my opinion-no pool...yikes!) and had to drop it all the way to 300 after it being on the market for many months (She is moving back to Thailand after her husband died). A neighbor across the street can’t get his sold for what he wants either and recently took it off the market after many months. And it isn’t an issue about high taxes.
Don’t understand your comment, “school tax remains as is.” In Texas, school tax makes up the preponderance of property tax. Is yours separate from property tax?
Geez! I'm all for good schools, but as we don't have kids it becomes less important to vote for increases.
Our tax bill also includes trash/recycling/yard debris removal (hurricanes create mountains of debris), Fire, Police, county/city slush fund, library and a couple of other programs.
It's a huge problem where I live, and as I commented when the topic poll came out is one of the reasons we have runaway government, at least where I live. So... here in Northern VA in Fairfax County our property taxes just go up every year. It's how they help fund the ginormous government they've created here. In the last three years the county has raised our assessment, 3.49%, 6.72%, 4.38% this last year. They now assess my home at an astronomical number that it could never sell for. They know that but they don't care. Their problem is the bill will come due, and we will sell, as will all the long time owners in our neighborhood for significantly less than they are assessed for which will have devastating effects on property values (and tax revenue). I think we may be seeing the very early signs of that starting. It's just insanity whats happened here in NoVa and I blame it all on the politicians and govie bureaucrats.
And to top it all off they've pivoted to floating bonds for infrastructure improvements, e.g. school and fire station rehabilitation and construction, etc... So while they can't balance the books to begin with, let's take on debt anyway just because. Democrats, shaking my damn head... 🤦♂️
I live in California, and Prop 13 (1% of the sales price and other local additions) has saved many people in this state from financial disaster. Of course, the one-party cabal here (democrat party) has been trying to eliminate Prop 13. They, of course, see a huge pile of tax revenue if they're successful. Just imagine a bunch of moronic democrats assessing new tax rates in a state where the median home price is well over 1M dollars. They will destroy the state overnight if that happens, and they already are destroying it, albeit more slowly.
Absolutely! I do not vote for democrats. And if they are the only ones on the ballot, which happens frequently here, I just leave it blank. I will NOT vote for democrats. IMO, they are out to destroy America. And they, in many ways, are doing a pretty damn good job of it.
There’s something inherently wrong about property taxes. You, usually in partnership with a bank, own your home. Your house provides you security and is a physical manifestation of your labor and intelligence, since it took both to generate the income to purchase it. The town then swoops in and begins feeding on it. You often pay a conveyance tax and then have the privilege of ponying up thousands year after year. God forbid you want to improve the property with a renovation or by adding a pool. Here come the planning and permit folks.Does the government do that on anything else you own once you own it. (Here in CT, that would be yes, I know thanks to our car taxes.) My point is you don’t really own your property in the State’s eyes. It lets you hold a title, but it’s really theirs. The government claims taxes are needed to cover essential services. Fine, then call the taxes what they are: massive HOAs. Meanwhile, what’s essential? Roads, water, sewer, fire, police. That’s it. There are gray areas, although I think individuals should choose and pay for their kids’ schools ourselves. Social services? Frankly, they create more problems than they solve. But parks with swimming pools, band shells, and turf fields sitting right next door to schools with swimming pools, auditoriums, and turf fields? Fireworks displays? Pollinator gardens? Grant-funded studies to justify taking more of money to spend on things we want, not things we need? At the end of the day, majorities vote for mission creep every cycle. As long as that happens, nothing will change.
New Haven is a modern-day feudal estate. Yale is the king’s fortress; the rest of the city are the precincts run by the Lords and populated with the peasants. While the palace doles out a hefty tribute annually, as a nonprofit Yale’s prodigious storehouse is off limits to the unwashed. That’s what to evils — the privileged Yale and corrupt Democrat pols — hath wrought.
Just a side note: Yesterday, I received a fund-raising letter from Moms for Liberty - an organization I’ve supported in the past. In the letter, they touted recent achievements, including co-sponsoring firework displays at Ellis Island and San Diego Harbor. What??!!
I love fireworks! But they should be funded by private organizations, including Moms for Liberty, whose members, donors, or, in the case of a corporation, consumers have a say in the wisdom and efficacy of the use of the funds. You have a choice, and I endorse your decision to express your opinion by withholding donations. That’s never the case when a government writes the check.
Actually the property tax is not the problem (as was noted; it's what the taxes are lavished upon). IIRC, the Founders restricted the franchise to (male) landowners. I'll duck the parenthetical (😁) but what has evolved is taxation without representation. Seems to me THAT was once fightin' words.
Since I have never bought a home, I was somewhat in the dark on the issue of property taxes. Recently I saw a video of a black woman in Bed-Stuy expressing grievance over how 'they is' taking over the neighborhood -- and deed theft.
I mentioned this to my brother, who fled a house in the Chicago suburbs (where we are from) to an apartment in the city proper.
My brother told me that this woman very likely failed to pay her property taxes. If you don't pay your property taxes, some other entity can pay them and seize your property.
In that regard, I can see why some people would resent 'gentrification' if it raises property taxes. Then again, why would the presence of higher income people raise property taxes? In NYC, the very same governance that wails about 'affordability' is the same entity responsible for 'pushing people out of their homes' with property taxes that they can't afford?
Likewise, my brother says that the property taxes on his home increased to the point where he could not sell that home and get back what he paid into it. He basically just took their possessions out of the house and left it to the bank. This after working three jobs to hold on to the house.
I read a piece in the Free Press about an elderly woman who received Mamdani's pied a terre tax threat. Doxed and everything. But this is her first home, not a second home. Due to her age, getting all the paperwork filed correctly and on time is going to be an issue. It seems that the city is against people making homes here.
Good Morning Underdog I need to read your Sex book excerpt, going on my to do list now. One of my best friends from high school still works for Linebarger, the Texas law firm who made billions collecting property taxes for governmental entities. I have friends in Austin like your brother who are upside down and can’t keep up with taxes on rising valuations. Yet the Prop 13 solution only results in even more outrageous valuations. I actually could support a pied-a-terre tax or a revision to the 1031 exchange rules, but that’s clearly a “consult your accountant” question which maybe one of our community could answer. I sure as hell can’t.
Section 1031 is a provision allowed investors or businesses to roll over gains into the next property they buy. It is not allowed for personal use, like a principal residence. Trump has been threatening to pass a tax exemption for gain on the sale of a principal residence. That’s a good rule and will allow people to keep the profits made by supporting the American dream.
Good point but I know people (Diet Coke Partner for example) who gamed the system by buying slum property on Alvarado Street in LA, doing the 1031 to buy an apartment at 14th and 7th Avenue in Manhattan then renting her real house in Venice Beach to live in NYC. Another friend sold his six room one story office building to the Koch Brothers in H town and became an instant millionaire ( on paper) then turned around and bought a large office building off 290 where he derived tens of thousands a month in income. I don’t Jack shit about money fyi. Thanks for the reminder
I think the gubmint is trying to force us all into 15-minute cities where we all rent "tiny houses" from it. Comrade Prickster is anxious to lead the way. As I mentioned above, my RE taxes are now only $200/month less than my mortgage payment. I'm convinced at least 50% of the tax rev goes into someone's pockets.
We’re seeing poor management and fraud everywhere these days. Property taxes are not exempt from these two maladies (crimes). This is being addressed in Florida because we have a governor who cares. My vote for the next governor will be partly based on this tax issue.
There are several reasons why housing has doubled since the Scamdemic and your local county and city governments love it. Schools and cities take the brunt of the pushback on property tax increases, but here in MN, the COUNTIES are the primary benefactors of your taxes(59%) and they are very unseen.
Go to your county and city council meetings. School boards as well.
I went to pay my 1st property taxes on my current land five years ago and made an ill advised joke about the plexiglass barrier and guns. The clerk immediately summoned the county tax assessor collector to grill me. I apologized so we spent 20 minutes visiting until he finally said “you seem like a good guy but here in the country, even my own cousin brought his shotgun in at one point to complain. Anyway, I went to UT with James Street.” And just like that he shook my hand through the partition . “Don’t make that joke again, please or I’ll call Judge Davis to dress you down in court”
If they can't take a joke then I would make fun of them all day and let their reaction reach the public. Like I said, the counties(at least here) almost operate in secret and intimidate. I went to renew my CC license and it was 1615 hours and the deputy was literally pissed that I showed up with 15 mins left to go in the 'work day'.
Good morning. Before I address the question presented, I have to thank everyone for yesterday’s conversation. I dipped in three times but held back until my 2nd Cape Cod nightcap (for the anti-Islamists Sobieski Polish vodka has a nice price point). My personal religious views most of my life were probably closer to Mr Karg’s..until my decadent life led me to some epiphany. As to property taxes, I have a unique perspective having lived in both Texas and California. The latter tried with Prop 13 to curb the rising taxes only to confront the dilemma of skyrocketing to the point of unreality real estate values. Texas has fairly high property taxes used to fund elementary and secondary education (The Permanent University Fund dumps a Mississippi of oil money into UT and A&M). One of my law school friends moved to Houston from LA (he grew up in Oklahoma) after not making partner at the Rockefeller’s law firm and the first words he said to me on Texas soil were “what the hell is up with the property taxes?”. We do have a homestead act and persons over 65 receive some abatements. As they say about death and taxes, they are the only two certainties and I have no answer for either.
I've heard that Texas property taxes are high from a percentage standpoint, but unless you are in Austin, Dallas, etc the cost of the housing is fairly reasonable.
Our house is 4BR/3B with a 2 car garage, a 25k gallon pool on just under an acre...and our taxes are just under $4k a year (with a homestead exemption)
And I went to the tax office to dispute paying that much.
I have homes in two states, IL and AZ. They are very far apart, both geographically and with respect to property taxes. Taxes for my home in downstate IL this year are $21,500. No, it is not a multi-million dollar domicile. It’s a nice home, but nothing near what those taxes should get you… my home in AZ is smaller, yet valued higher than my IL home - and yet my taxes are UNDER $4,000. When I first got my AZ tax bill, I thought it was a quarterly assessment. IL has among the highest, if not THE highest property taxes. People are leaving the state because of it. They keep increasing them to fund the schools (which are subpar) and yet will not allow a voucher or scholarship tax benefit. Now you’ve got me started… Needless to say, we won’t be keeping property in IL for much longer… sad but a person/taxpayer can only take so much.
Love Sedona. Here’s a poem: What Ken Wrote on the Rock at Sedona: Great Spirit, come back/Goddess, we are listening. 👂 I actually picked up a red rock and wrote it on Bell Canyon while hiking.
You just have to raise the money generated by property taxes by some other method.
A local sales tax would be an example, but regressive as hell. One problem, as we all know, is the bloated local budgets. Perhaps some federal allocation to the states to help reduce property taxes. There are enough smart people out there that can figure this out, what is missing is the will to accomplish it. Florida is at least trying to do something to lesson the burden.
No you don’t have to replace every property tax dollar. That’s what those in power want you to think. You just have to make choices regarding on what the money is spent and learn how to say no. No to employees who want huge raises, no to the unions, no to those who want anything more than life safety departments and libraries.
Here in Hellinois, my RE taxes are only $200 per month less than my mortgage payment. It's about $12,500 per year for a simple townhouse in my area. Despite the high taxes I was shocked to find out I actually have to pay to go to my town beach (for which I've paid taxes), pay for a school bus, pay $650 per kid for books/technology, etc etc etc!!
Local sales tax just went up to 10.5%. 😱
I have to assume that a large portion of my tax money lands right in politicians' pockets. 😡
With one or two pot shops on every corner, I want to know why all that drug money isn't reducing my taxes!! Significantly! See paragraph above.
How do we all get together and refuse to pay taxes?
In Evanston, tax on weed revenue goes to funding reparations payments to black residents. There is also a transaction fee on real-estate sales that funds reparations. We have friends there who seem to be oblivious to this fact. I think Illinois has the highest property tax in the country. Weren't you talking about moving to Florida?
Alas, dear Jen. My hubby is determined to work himself to death. We are moving toward the state-of-sanity at a glacial pace. 😢 I'm going to try to nudge him by spending as much of the winter down south this year as I can!
No slaves. Btw, applicants must own a home in order to qualify because the money must go to home improvements. They don't even have to prove discrimination. So how'd they get a house? The WSJ ran an article about it and said that six people filed a lawsuit challenging Evanston in federal court over this reparations scam. I think the DOJ has gotten involved.
After reading about it yesterday it did ring a bell that I had heard about it way back when proposed but never thought it went forward. It is sold as being reparations for redlining, so you have to have lived there between 1919-1969?, or be the child or grandchild of someone who did, and be black.
My answer to the question is one that RFKJ put out as a plank to his presidential run last year. I don't really know that much about blockchain technology, but from what I gather when something is on blockchain everyone can see how every penny is spent. I think this sort of transparency would have the best chance at fixing the property tax issue, with a potential side effect of the crooks (government types) just getting more creative on how to hide all the waste and fraud. But my answer in general is we need to do things that give us more transparency and more accountability.
Thinking personally, as a resident of Texas, I spent a little time learning about Texas property tax laws. I then carefully selected a parcel of land in a county with lower tax rates and the ability to get some sort of tax exemption. I ended up with a livestock exemption, which exempts all but the house and one acre of land where I pay the county rate. If, for some unknown reason, we lose the cattle exemption, I'll get some bees and get the agricultural exemption.
So, hold the government authorities accountable, know your tax laws, and pick carefully. They pray the ba$tards don't change the laws on you.
There are two closely connected drivers of rising property taxes. The first is that school taxes make up the largest share of most property tax bills. The second is that public service budgets are dominated by compensation costs dictated by powerful public-sector unions. As those costs grow, property taxes follow.
The issue of public education has been discussed many times. The system is failing on both fronts. Academically, too many students leave school without mastering reading, writing, math, and other basic skills. Instead, ideological indoctrination has become an increasingly important part of the curriculum. The education system should do one thing: teach children to read, write, think, and master the basic skills. But do it well. Proficiency should be the criterion for teacher evaluation, not tenure or political activism. The educational system should be reformed from top to bottom. It should not remain a blank check for a bloated bureaucracy, layers of administrators, and ineffective teachers.
The other issue is public-sector unions, with teachers' unions being the most obvious example. They dictate salaries, pensions, benefits, and work rules that drive ever-growing public service budgets. Those budgets are funded largely through property taxes, leaving homeowners to foot the bill.
And we are back to politics. Both problems are political. Reducing the power of public-sector unions, restoring schools to their core mission of teaching basic skills, and shrinking government are conservative principles. Vote Democratic, and you will keep getting bigger government, stronger public-sector unions, higher spending—and higher property taxes.
Our little mountain town has invited a firm based in bat-shit leftist Asheville to hold a public meeting tonight about ‘revitalizing’ our historic downtown. The meeting is tonight. We’re dreading it, but we know we have to attend.
Asheville’s downtown was lovely - quaint, historic, entertaining, uniquely artsy - before ‘revitalization’ chased all that away, in exchange for breweries and wine cafes, over-priced eateries and trendy coffee shops. Is that all people do these days - eat and drink?
It’s a real issue. My property taxes are a 1/3 of my monthly mortgage bill. And the town and state services seem to be getting worse, not better and the school always seems to need more money, not less. It’s infuriating since I know there’s money mismanagement that I am paying for. There’s now a big push by about 5 people in town to apply for a grant to do a study on how to add better bike lanes to our downtown. Which means once the “free” study is done, they’ll want it implemented for god knows how much money which will also require more money and personnel to clear snow from in the winter when we have pot holes in the road. Make it make sense. This issue just might be the one that breaks the camels back though for our town to stop saying yes to everything. I hope.
Spending other people's money is what they do.
Hi Kate The gubmint (as we say in Texas) is all about money mismanagement, it’s why the new variety of socialism is so unrealistic. Couldn’t a worker just paint some lines between the right lane and sidewalk for bike lanes? Nope, We need a bunch of dopes to do a study. Absurd.
We've been fighting off something like that in my town, too. But, here it is a proposal to build a Senior Center. Yes, there was grant funding for the study. But who then has to build and maintain the Center for the next X years? And of course the Senior Center will require some staff to coordinate activities and apply for more grants.
Easy one. Just vote them out. When we were looking to purchase a home closer to NYC we looked in Greenwich CT and several towns in Westchester County. We saw a beautiful house for $1.6 million but property taxes were over $46,000 a year. Insane. We bought in CT. Price a bit higher but but property taxes $12 K. What is wrong with New Yorkers. Why do they put up with this insanity. Greenwich schools are at least as good and probably better than Westchester schools. So where is all the money going? Vote them out. Or do liberal Democrats enjoy subsidizing waste, fraud and abuse. Which they clearly are doing?
We live in a world where increasingly people go with the flow when it comes to the size of govt. Increasingly most people want the govt to solve their problems. The larger the govt the more waste, fraud and abuse.
But how do we shrink the size and scope of govt? Do we as a people have the will to do that anymore? And who exactly is WE?
Yesterday i read an essay written by a friend that detailed how the country had changed from what de tocqueville described ( community and other local organizations and groups taking care of their families and neighbors and where being on what we now call welfare was viewed as impinging on one's dignity as a citizen) to what occurred in the 20th century with the great society and the creation of our modern welfare state obliterating the country de tocquiville wrote about. As the writer noted , today WE ( not all) seem to want the govt to simply solve all problems. The result is not just the rampant fraud bruce mentions but so much more at an individual level ( eg getting on disability by scamming the system; that is not an indictment of the notion of disability but the reality of rampant fraud, often facilitated by lawyers and doctors: the disappearance of virtue indeed)
Property taxes aren't the problem; rather it is our dependence on big govt and the fact that as the country grew and became wealthier the old virtues receded. JFK recognized this when he gave his ASK NOT inauguration address. We did not listen then and we are not listening now. We simply want the govt to make things more affordable. But yet no one explains how that is to be done ( other than tax the billionaires ) and what the downside consequences might be of whatever our moronic leaders choose to do next
In the meantime, as bruce notes people need to give serious thought as to where they choose to live ( state or town) recognizing that that choice will impact affordability matters in many different ways.
Great post. I am a firm believer in Jeffersonian limited government as filtered through President Reagan
One example of choosing where to not live is NY City. The mayor wants to make the most expensive city in the US affordable. Make that make sense.
Exactly. When I hear moaning and groaning about affordability from someone who graduated college and moved to THE CITY for the NY EXPERIENCE, I wonder if little Susie or Mary or Johnny ever thought about the cost of living or the fact that their impact on housing demand might 1) result in overall higher rents and 2) the impact of their NY experience on native NYers who are actual working people. I would love to see data and stats on how many who lived in Manhattan had to move elsewhere due to the increased demand ( and limited supply)
"When contacted for comment, the Real Estate Board of New York (REBNY) President James Whelan told Fox News Digital, "We opposed this tax in part because we warned that determining who is and is not subject to it would be extraordinarily complicated. The fact that so many owners appear to be receiving inaccurate notices raises serious questions about the City's readiness to administer the program. Even we did not expect implementation to be this flawed."
https://www.foxnews.com/media/liberal-podcaster-says-he-doxed-mamdanis-wanted-poster-property-owners
Govt bein govt?
And of course, it's the homeowner's problem to file the paper work to refute the tax.
I read that article, Bizarre
Poor Scott. Socialism is coming for you too. Fellating the mayor apparently didn’t merit a red rose or a Hallmark card. Are you still going to cast your People Magazine’s ‘World’s Sexiest Man’ vote for him this year? Probably.
He's whining about being doxxed...but too stupid to realize he's the object of Mamdani's scorn.
Not until he learns to swallow…🧐
Hi Brian at least you don’t need a car. But the postage stamp apartments for $2 million don’t work for me. Bars are cheap lol 😆
Bars aren’t cheep in Texas ?
Sure where I drink lol 😝 but Houston is the NYC of Texas and pompous oil heirs and heiresses like to social climb with $24 martinis. And The new Austin, well it ain’t Shiner Bock and Jim Beam anymore. Sad 😢
I understand. That’s what happens when money comes to town from far away. I bet the bars are still cheep in Odesa. I went there for business once, due diligence on a business. It was when oil was in bust phase. All the shops were closed in town and people just got up and left everything in the stores. A true ghost town.
Lone Star in a bottle.
Good Morning Bruce. Wish I was in France where wine is cheaper than Diet Coke. My old college suitemate freshman year lives in Greenwich, CT and does money management: Curt Gadow. Great guy. Safe travels. PS I like strong wine such as Cote du Rhone
I am a big believer in channeling those long gone.
For example, I just love it when John Mayer channels Jerry Garcia.
One of my Austin rhythm guitarists is a huge Deadhead (and punk go figure) who showed me some amazing footage of John Meyer channeling Jerry. There is only one Jerry (I say this as a non Deadhead mostly due to the tie dyed druggie followers) but he was a great guitar player. Funny story: my friend got in my car once on the way to practice and saw my cassette of Bill Monroe and said “The Dead like this guy”. Guess he never heard real bluegrass (maybe Old and In the Way). We should have a discussion day on the Dead: good, bad and ugly. lol 😝
Sounds good to me.
The day Weir passed away I was texts from all over the country from friends who were heartbroken.
We don’t really pay high property taxes here in Florida. The Save Our Homes cap and the homestead exemption with portability up to $500k prevents big tax hikes. That said, our schools are crumbling and we get beat up by insurance premiums.
The insurance companies are worse than the banks imho
Insurance companies can't print money.
True. I didn’t say they were worse than the federal government lol 😂
but they're close. Our homeowner's policy has basically doubled in the last three years - with no claims until this year (hail storm took out the roof).
Ah, but property insurance comes pretty close to being Actual Insurance. (As opposed to the other end of the spectrum, health whateveritis, which long ago ceased to be insurance.) There are many reasons why premiums go up, but a simple way to find out whether the increases are justified: Regularly shop out the policy. (A good agent/broker should be doing that for you routinely.)
We do that with our Auto Insurance often, as well.
our broker blamed California...and also the flooding last summer north of us for the rate increases
Could be. Or could be he's got reasons to keep you where you are.
Hoping the purposed property tax elimination/reduction bill will pass here in Florida. If passed by voters, it will increase the homestead exemption from 50k to $150,000 and then increase to $250,000 the following year.
Good luck. 50k is a joke. What can you buy for that in Florida? A shack near the skunk ape in the Everglades?
If the bill passes, it's possible that a homeowner could pay no property tax (school tax remains as is). The bill doesn't completely eliminate property tax, but it would dramatically benefit homeowners across the board. I'd love to have a tax exemption of 250k.
That’s probably the median home price now,
394,000 is the median home price in Florida according to AI. 150k homestead credit is great for someone who owns an almost 400k property. If passed, it goes up to $250k.
May not be the case in Jen’s neck of the woods, but Florida property values have taken a dip in many areas, including mine. A neighbor listed her house for 400k (too high in my opinion-no pool...yikes!) and had to drop it all the way to 300 after it being on the market for many months (She is moving back to Thailand after her husband died). A neighbor across the street can’t get his sold for what he wants either and recently took it off the market after many months. And it isn’t an issue about high taxes.
Well, you are in Sebring. I'm sure Sebring is lovely, but it isn't on either coast. Being close to either coast is high tax. You're right about that.
Yes. A different story on the coasts for sure
Don’t understand your comment, “school tax remains as is.” In Texas, school tax makes up the preponderance of property tax. Is yours separate from property tax?
About 35% of our property tax goes to schools.
It’s about 80% of ours
Geez! I'm all for good schools, but as we don't have kids it becomes less important to vote for increases.
Our tax bill also includes trash/recycling/yard debris removal (hurricanes create mountains of debris), Fire, Police, county/city slush fund, library and a couple of other programs.
Yes I am confused as well. ❔❔❔🙋♂️
It's a huge problem where I live, and as I commented when the topic poll came out is one of the reasons we have runaway government, at least where I live. So... here in Northern VA in Fairfax County our property taxes just go up every year. It's how they help fund the ginormous government they've created here. In the last three years the county has raised our assessment, 3.49%, 6.72%, 4.38% this last year. They now assess my home at an astronomical number that it could never sell for. They know that but they don't care. Their problem is the bill will come due, and we will sell, as will all the long time owners in our neighborhood for significantly less than they are assessed for which will have devastating effects on property values (and tax revenue). I think we may be seeing the very early signs of that starting. It's just insanity whats happened here in NoVa and I blame it all on the politicians and govie bureaucrats.
And to top it all off they've pivoted to floating bonds for infrastructure improvements, e.g. school and fire station rehabilitation and construction, etc... So while they can't balance the books to begin with, let's take on debt anyway just because. Democrats, shaking my damn head... 🤦♂️
Democrats: The Drunken Sailor Spending Party. So let’s select a hot Mexican bartender or a doddering Vermont Commie as our presidential nominee. Smdh
Illinois is worse…
Hi. Don’t take this comment the wrong way but your picture is cute. And you’re a writer. Cool. 😎
It’s time to move.
I live in California, and Prop 13 (1% of the sales price and other local additions) has saved many people in this state from financial disaster. Of course, the one-party cabal here (democrat party) has been trying to eliminate Prop 13. They, of course, see a huge pile of tax revenue if they're successful. Just imagine a bunch of moronic democrats assessing new tax rates in a state where the median home price is well over 1M dollars. They will destroy the state overnight if that happens, and they already are destroying it, albeit more slowly.
Hope you are considering Steve Hilton for governor.
Absolutely! I do not vote for democrats. And if they are the only ones on the ballot, which happens frequently here, I just leave it blank. I will NOT vote for democrats. IMO, they are out to destroy America. And they, in many ways, are doing a pretty damn good job of it.
Yes to everything you said. I think Steve Hilton is great. He's so smart and common sense. I've yet to hear about a sex scandal, so...
There’s something inherently wrong about property taxes. You, usually in partnership with a bank, own your home. Your house provides you security and is a physical manifestation of your labor and intelligence, since it took both to generate the income to purchase it. The town then swoops in and begins feeding on it. You often pay a conveyance tax and then have the privilege of ponying up thousands year after year. God forbid you want to improve the property with a renovation or by adding a pool. Here come the planning and permit folks.Does the government do that on anything else you own once you own it. (Here in CT, that would be yes, I know thanks to our car taxes.) My point is you don’t really own your property in the State’s eyes. It lets you hold a title, but it’s really theirs. The government claims taxes are needed to cover essential services. Fine, then call the taxes what they are: massive HOAs. Meanwhile, what’s essential? Roads, water, sewer, fire, police. That’s it. There are gray areas, although I think individuals should choose and pay for their kids’ schools ourselves. Social services? Frankly, they create more problems than they solve. But parks with swimming pools, band shells, and turf fields sitting right next door to schools with swimming pools, auditoriums, and turf fields? Fireworks displays? Pollinator gardens? Grant-funded studies to justify taking more of money to spend on things we want, not things we need? At the end of the day, majorities vote for mission creep every cycle. As long as that happens, nothing will change.
Y’all have a seriously out of control gubmint regulation problem up there.
It’s CT.
I’ve visited, beautiful state. Why is Yale in such a crappy area? Reminded me of USC-my guess is it’s so old the city decayed around it.
New Haven is a modern-day feudal estate. Yale is the king’s fortress; the rest of the city are the precincts run by the Lords and populated with the peasants. While the palace doles out a hefty tribute annually, as a nonprofit Yale’s prodigious storehouse is off limits to the unwashed. That’s what to evils — the privileged Yale and corrupt Democrat pols — hath wrought.
Just a side note: Yesterday, I received a fund-raising letter from Moms for Liberty - an organization I’ve supported in the past. In the letter, they touted recent achievements, including co-sponsoring firework displays at Ellis Island and San Diego Harbor. What??!!
No more donations from me.
I love fireworks! But they should be funded by private organizations, including Moms for Liberty, whose members, donors, or, in the case of a corporation, consumers have a say in the wisdom and efficacy of the use of the funds. You have a choice, and I endorse your decision to express your opinion by withholding donations. That’s never the case when a government writes the check.
💯
Actually the property tax is not the problem (as was noted; it's what the taxes are lavished upon). IIRC, the Founders restricted the franchise to (male) landowners. I'll duck the parenthetical (😁) but what has evolved is taxation without representation. Seems to me THAT was once fightin' words.
Yes. Ownership is with the state. Try not paying your “rent” to the assessor/collector and see what happens.
Since I have never bought a home, I was somewhat in the dark on the issue of property taxes. Recently I saw a video of a black woman in Bed-Stuy expressing grievance over how 'they is' taking over the neighborhood -- and deed theft.
I mentioned this to my brother, who fled a house in the Chicago suburbs (where we are from) to an apartment in the city proper.
My brother told me that this woman very likely failed to pay her property taxes. If you don't pay your property taxes, some other entity can pay them and seize your property.
In that regard, I can see why some people would resent 'gentrification' if it raises property taxes. Then again, why would the presence of higher income people raise property taxes? In NYC, the very same governance that wails about 'affordability' is the same entity responsible for 'pushing people out of their homes' with property taxes that they can't afford?
Likewise, my brother says that the property taxes on his home increased to the point where he could not sell that home and get back what he paid into it. He basically just took their possessions out of the house and left it to the bank. This after working three jobs to hold on to the house.
I read a piece in the Free Press about an elderly woman who received Mamdani's pied a terre tax threat. Doxed and everything. But this is her first home, not a second home. Due to her age, getting all the paperwork filed correctly and on time is going to be an issue. It seems that the city is against people making homes here.
Good Morning Underdog I need to read your Sex book excerpt, going on my to do list now. One of my best friends from high school still works for Linebarger, the Texas law firm who made billions collecting property taxes for governmental entities. I have friends in Austin like your brother who are upside down and can’t keep up with taxes on rising valuations. Yet the Prop 13 solution only results in even more outrageous valuations. I actually could support a pied-a-terre tax or a revision to the 1031 exchange rules, but that’s clearly a “consult your accountant” question which maybe one of our community could answer. I sure as hell can’t.
Section 1031 is a provision allowed investors or businesses to roll over gains into the next property they buy. It is not allowed for personal use, like a principal residence. Trump has been threatening to pass a tax exemption for gain on the sale of a principal residence. That’s a good rule and will allow people to keep the profits made by supporting the American dream.
Good point but I know people (Diet Coke Partner for example) who gamed the system by buying slum property on Alvarado Street in LA, doing the 1031 to buy an apartment at 14th and 7th Avenue in Manhattan then renting her real house in Venice Beach to live in NYC. Another friend sold his six room one story office building to the Koch Brothers in H town and became an instant millionaire ( on paper) then turned around and bought a large office building off 290 where he derived tens of thousands a month in income. I don’t Jack shit about money fyi. Thanks for the reminder
You have illustrated how 1031 works and how people take advantage of it. I saw that all the time as a PwC tax partner, the numbers were just bigger.
I think the gubmint is trying to force us all into 15-minute cities where we all rent "tiny houses" from it. Comrade Prickster is anxious to lead the way. As I mentioned above, my RE taxes are now only $200/month less than my mortgage payment. I'm convinced at least 50% of the tax rev goes into someone's pockets.
I’m thinking of selling here and moving to Rainey Street in Austin to die in the 15 minute city area.
Probably safer for you to not be alone in the middle of nowhere.
I sent the final August post fyi. Safe travels
I thought I sent you the preview for that.
You might have. I spent the afternoon working on a poem for the Houston Texas. Football 🏈 long sorry story lol
That lady was Alex Berenson’s mother. He wrote the article for the Free Press and then posted to his substack so I was able to read it. CRAZY.
We’re seeing poor management and fraud everywhere these days. Property taxes are not exempt from these two maladies (crimes). This is being addressed in Florida because we have a governor who cares. My vote for the next governor will be partly based on this tax issue.
Do you prefer Byron Donalds or Jay Collins. The fact that DeSantis endorsed Collins, has me thinking seriously about this.
I’m still undecided. Trump endorsed Donalds but I’m not sure about him. Collins, I don’t know much about. Time to do some research
There are several reasons why housing has doubled since the Scamdemic and your local county and city governments love it. Schools and cities take the brunt of the pushback on property tax increases, but here in MN, the COUNTIES are the primary benefactors of your taxes(59%) and they are very unseen.
Go to your county and city council meetings. School boards as well.
I went to pay my 1st property taxes on my current land five years ago and made an ill advised joke about the plexiglass barrier and guns. The clerk immediately summoned the county tax assessor collector to grill me. I apologized so we spent 20 minutes visiting until he finally said “you seem like a good guy but here in the country, even my own cousin brought his shotgun in at one point to complain. Anyway, I went to UT with James Street.” And just like that he shook my hand through the partition . “Don’t make that joke again, please or I’ll call Judge Davis to dress you down in court”
If they can't take a joke then I would make fun of them all day and let their reaction reach the public. Like I said, the counties(at least here) almost operate in secret and intimidate. I went to renew my CC license and it was 1615 hours and the deputy was literally pissed that I showed up with 15 mins left to go in the 'work day'.
Aren’t you from Texas? North Dallas? Different world up there
Unfortunately, I am from MN where we are living a form of the 1917 communist revolution: a mere handful of commies are in charge of the state.
Wow 😮
Good morning. Before I address the question presented, I have to thank everyone for yesterday’s conversation. I dipped in three times but held back until my 2nd Cape Cod nightcap (for the anti-Islamists Sobieski Polish vodka has a nice price point). My personal religious views most of my life were probably closer to Mr Karg’s..until my decadent life led me to some epiphany. As to property taxes, I have a unique perspective having lived in both Texas and California. The latter tried with Prop 13 to curb the rising taxes only to confront the dilemma of skyrocketing to the point of unreality real estate values. Texas has fairly high property taxes used to fund elementary and secondary education (The Permanent University Fund dumps a Mississippi of oil money into UT and A&M). One of my law school friends moved to Houston from LA (he grew up in Oklahoma) after not making partner at the Rockefeller’s law firm and the first words he said to me on Texas soil were “what the hell is up with the property taxes?”. We do have a homestead act and persons over 65 receive some abatements. As they say about death and taxes, they are the only two certainties and I have no answer for either.
I've heard that Texas property taxes are high from a percentage standpoint, but unless you are in Austin, Dallas, etc the cost of the housing is fairly reasonable.
Our house is 4BR/3B with a 2 car garage, a 25k gallon pool on just under an acre...and our taxes are just under $4k a year (with a homestead exemption)
And I went to the tax office to dispute paying that much.
Are you getting the over 65 exemption?
Nope - cuz I ain't 65
I should've married an older woman
Dang. Probably too late now. 😊
I have homes in two states, IL and AZ. They are very far apart, both geographically and with respect to property taxes. Taxes for my home in downstate IL this year are $21,500. No, it is not a multi-million dollar domicile. It’s a nice home, but nothing near what those taxes should get you… my home in AZ is smaller, yet valued higher than my IL home - and yet my taxes are UNDER $4,000. When I first got my AZ tax bill, I thought it was a quarterly assessment. IL has among the highest, if not THE highest property taxes. People are leaving the state because of it. They keep increasing them to fund the schools (which are subpar) and yet will not allow a voucher or scholarship tax benefit. Now you’ve got me started… Needless to say, we won’t be keeping property in IL for much longer… sad but a person/taxpayer can only take so much.
Love Sedona. Here’s a poem: What Ken Wrote on the Rock at Sedona: Great Spirit, come back/Goddess, we are listening. 👂 I actually picked up a red rock and wrote it on Bell Canyon while hiking.
You just have to raise the money generated by property taxes by some other method.
A local sales tax would be an example, but regressive as hell. One problem, as we all know, is the bloated local budgets. Perhaps some federal allocation to the states to help reduce property taxes. There are enough smart people out there that can figure this out, what is missing is the will to accomplish it. Florida is at least trying to do something to lesson the burden.
What is going on with the SALT exemption? We do not have state income taxes in Texas
I’ve not kept up with this part of the law.
I’ll be moving to Florida this fall and giving Trenton NJ the middle finger.
Hope Jersey hasn’t adopted a move-out tax, like Canada!
Hmmm 🤔
I’ve watch Gad Saad scream and yell on Twitter about this.
He is pretty pissed off.
No you don’t have to replace every property tax dollar. That’s what those in power want you to think. You just have to make choices regarding on what the money is spent and learn how to say no. No to employees who want huge raises, no to the unions, no to those who want anything more than life safety departments and libraries.
The smart people all seem to be engaged in dreaming up new ways to tax.
There are lots of ways to tax.
Here in Hellinois, my RE taxes are only $200 per month less than my mortgage payment. It's about $12,500 per year for a simple townhouse in my area. Despite the high taxes I was shocked to find out I actually have to pay to go to my town beach (for which I've paid taxes), pay for a school bus, pay $650 per kid for books/technology, etc etc etc!!
Local sales tax just went up to 10.5%. 😱
I have to assume that a large portion of my tax money lands right in politicians' pockets. 😡
With one or two pot shops on every corner, I want to know why all that drug money isn't reducing my taxes!! Significantly! See paragraph above.
How do we all get together and refuse to pay taxes?
Hellinois. Instant classic! Well played, Sir.
It's M'am. 😉
In Evanston, tax on weed revenue goes to funding reparations payments to black residents. There is also a transaction fee on real-estate sales that funds reparations. We have friends there who seem to be oblivious to this fact. I think Illinois has the highest property tax in the country. Weren't you talking about moving to Florida?
Alas, dear Jen. My hubby is determined to work himself to death. We are moving toward the state-of-sanity at a glacial pace. 😢 I'm going to try to nudge him by spending as much of the winter down south this year as I can!
They are really paying reparations in Evanston? I didn't know anyplace actually went forward with payments.
They really are. I have my doubts about how that's going to turn out.
They NEVER will stop asking for reparations. It will never be enough. Just another scam.
They've already doled out 5 million.
How many slaves did Illinois have? How many of those former slaves are still alive?
No slaves. Btw, applicants must own a home in order to qualify because the money must go to home improvements. They don't even have to prove discrimination. So how'd they get a house? The WSJ ran an article about it and said that six people filed a lawsuit challenging Evanston in federal court over this reparations scam. I think the DOJ has gotten involved.
After reading about it yesterday it did ring a bell that I had heard about it way back when proposed but never thought it went forward. It is sold as being reparations for redlining, so you have to have lived there between 1919-1969?, or be the child or grandchild of someone who did, and be black.
It’s a pretty significant red flag when every other governor goes to prison. Get the hell out.
We had a joke at one point that they should simply be sent to jail upon election.
My answer to the question is one that RFKJ put out as a plank to his presidential run last year. I don't really know that much about blockchain technology, but from what I gather when something is on blockchain everyone can see how every penny is spent. I think this sort of transparency would have the best chance at fixing the property tax issue, with a potential side effect of the crooks (government types) just getting more creative on how to hide all the waste and fraud. But my answer in general is we need to do things that give us more transparency and more accountability.
Thinking personally, as a resident of Texas, I spent a little time learning about Texas property tax laws. I then carefully selected a parcel of land in a county with lower tax rates and the ability to get some sort of tax exemption. I ended up with a livestock exemption, which exempts all but the house and one acre of land where I pay the county rate. If, for some unknown reason, we lose the cattle exemption, I'll get some bees and get the agricultural exemption.
So, hold the government authorities accountable, know your tax laws, and pick carefully. They pray the ba$tards don't change the laws on you.
There are two closely connected drivers of rising property taxes. The first is that school taxes make up the largest share of most property tax bills. The second is that public service budgets are dominated by compensation costs dictated by powerful public-sector unions. As those costs grow, property taxes follow.
The issue of public education has been discussed many times. The system is failing on both fronts. Academically, too many students leave school without mastering reading, writing, math, and other basic skills. Instead, ideological indoctrination has become an increasingly important part of the curriculum. The education system should do one thing: teach children to read, write, think, and master the basic skills. But do it well. Proficiency should be the criterion for teacher evaluation, not tenure or political activism. The educational system should be reformed from top to bottom. It should not remain a blank check for a bloated bureaucracy, layers of administrators, and ineffective teachers.
The other issue is public-sector unions, with teachers' unions being the most obvious example. They dictate salaries, pensions, benefits, and work rules that drive ever-growing public service budgets. Those budgets are funded largely through property taxes, leaving homeowners to foot the bill.
And we are back to politics. Both problems are political. Reducing the power of public-sector unions, restoring schools to their core mission of teaching basic skills, and shrinking government are conservative principles. Vote Democratic, and you will keep getting bigger government, stronger public-sector unions, higher spending—and higher property taxes.
Agreed. The Teacher's unions and the SEIU will NEVER have enough.
Our little mountain town has invited a firm based in bat-shit leftist Asheville to hold a public meeting tonight about ‘revitalizing’ our historic downtown. The meeting is tonight. We’re dreading it, but we know we have to attend.
Asheville’s downtown was lovely - quaint, historic, entertaining, uniquely artsy - before ‘revitalization’ chased all that away, in exchange for breweries and wine cafes, over-priced eateries and trendy coffee shops. Is that all people do these days - eat and drink?
Hope you aren't in Brevard. One of the gems that we like to visit.
No, Franklin.
Brevard is where they are building the latest data center.